Hello from Durham - totally new to G gauge: building a 'Sodor' garden layout for Bachmann Thomas trains

ThomasDadDurham

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Hello - totally new to G gauge, but had an HO layout as a kid. Experienced modeller, which I'll get to.
After living in a tiny new build far too small to raise boy number 1, not knowing where my medical wifes job would end up being, we're finally moving to a long, long saved for house with a decent sized garden and a bigger workshop for me.
For ten years Ive been modelmaking in some form as a dayjob: Props, replicas, rubber, foam, white metal casting - bit of everything. It was during the recession: after the sector I was working in post-graduation was cut to the bone, and a glut of quality machinery appeared 2nd hand due to companies going under, that it became my full time job. I realised I was making more money from 'selling hobby bits' than I was from my paycheque. I flip between projects as a contractor (TV, Theatre) and commissions (casting/making parts for other little garage companies, or my own things) The amount of machine-shop I have crammed into a single garage got to be a bit of a joke. Also I need to expand into 3d printing before im left behind the curve, and a decent lasercutter too: both processes which Im currently reliant on a friend one town over. So double garage it had to be!

Anyway both my little boy and my friends little boy who lives a few miles away, love Thomas and anything steam train related. Although toddlers they grasp the difference between a 'push it around' toy and a 'just watch it go around the track' toy, so Im not too worried. Theres also baby number two coming to us so I should get a few years out of Thomas and sodor theme. Once they're older I'll look at more 'realistic, grown up' trains. I came into a job lot of Bachmanns G Thomas, Percy, Toby, James, and lots of stock. Plain DC, no DCC or mods. I plan to expand the rolling stock with repainted cheapo NQD tankers and anything 2nd hand I can grab. Gathered just enough used LGB track for two parralel loops and a pair of 5Amp start controllers.

Im slapping an office/materials store on the back of the new double garage so that will be the layout start point, and my wife has agreed to let it take up one edge or corner completely (closest to the back of the double garage) and also a loop completely around the edge borders - with the condition Im also building rockeries and borders while Im on, and it is ground level and not a trip hazard besides the house - not a problem.

I want to have it ready to run outdoors next spring, so boy number 1 and his friend can play with it to distract from the upheaval of a baby sibling - I'll be taking less or even no work on at that point as I did when the first arrived. With me literally working in my garage its actually pretty easy to get 'garden' stuff done, theres always an hour here or there to go dig or shift gravel for a little bit when Im waiting for something to cure, cut, melt or set, and if Im on my feet in the workshop Id rather do that than go do admin. (I set aside one day a week for the 'sit on my arse staring at a screen stuff' because I get migraines from it. One of the reasons Ive never looked back after leaving employment!)
Ive got autumn and winter to play with it indoors and understand the more complex electronics for what I ultimately want to do!

If anyone reading this wants to links me to topics, manufacturers or websites for the following queries please do when saying Hello!
  1. I was looking at the RRConcepts Stationmaster setup for alternating trains (Im planning one manually controlled track for shunting and play, and one automated to just let a pair run to watch - DCC seems too big a splashout while it remains primarily to enjoy with children) Ive been told that the 'one goes, one waits, then swap' setup is entirely possible to do with plug-and-play LGB components without buying the 'Stationmaster' modules from the US? This true? While there are piles of DC electronics for sale everywhere, theres zero information on what things are and how they all connect. Ive only just grasped how points work compared to self isolating HO ones, and that took a lot of Googling and decoding wiring plans. Stationmaster worth it, or can you tell me what I can buy that does the same from within Europe?

  2. Talking of printing and moulding - Troublesome truck faces for this scale anyone? Theres lots I can scratchbuild and convert for rolling stock, but if anyone has already made a variety of faces it saves me a lot of time!

  3. Inclines! I want at least one bridge or tunnel where the lines cross. I keep seeing '1 in 40' or 'no less than 1 in 30' bandied about but Ive seen videos that are clearly less than that, perhaps even 1 in 20! What have people reliably run on? Is it best to build inclines out of concrete beneath the ballast layer, so they dont sink over the years of weather?

  4. Has anyone (who isnt solely contactable by the digital binfire that is Twitter) made a Gordon model in this scale - its a future project I'd like to try. Remodelling a BR78 chassis isnt an issue (after all I have the entire workshop for cutting and milling small metal things), but if theres an existing 3D printable file out there for the bodywork it'd save me months of work!

  5. Buildings. Im fully skilled up and tooled up to make my own, mould them and cast multiples - but are there any producers out there making premade moulds? Silicone has become expensive the last few years.
    Premade kits, Im aware of a two producers of 'UK style' buildings: Canforth Models and Modeltown. Any others?

  6. Shows and exhibitions: boy number 1 loves going to watch the HO and O layouts at Newton Aycliffe Rotary Clubs shows - any large gauge shows in the North, or are we cursed to have to drive 2+ hours to the Yorkshire show in September, making a weekend of it with some National Trust properties?

  7. Cheap LGB track? On joining here and browsing I see Ive been paying a few quid over the forum rates for R2 curves and points so far :(
FWIW, once we're up and running in the new house, Im happy to be someone people can turn to for things they dont have the tools or materials to do themselves: White metal casting Im always happy to take on even the smallest things (can squash things onto unused space of other moulds). Other stuff (resin, metal machining, lasercutting) etc will be dependant on how I setup the workshop once moved and what Im focussing on at the time - wether thats a new baby or some mad project like casting 100 rubber muskets or Gondorian belt buckles and scabbard fittings.

Thanks everyone!
 
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dunnyrail

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Hello - totally new to G gauge, but had an HO layout as a kid. Experienced modeller, which I'll get to.
After living in a tiny new build far too small to raise boy number 1, not knowing where my medical wifes job would end up being, we're finally moving to a long, long saved for house with a decent sized garden and a bigger workshop for me.
For ten years Ive been modelmaking in some form as a dayjob: Props, replicas, rubber, foam, white metal casting - bit of everything. It was during the recession: after the sector I was working in post-graduation was cut to the bone, and a glut of quality machinery appeared 2nd hand due to companies going under, that it became my full time job. I realised I was making more money from 'selling hobby bits' than I was from my paycheque. I flip between projects as a contractor (TV, Theatre) and commissions (casting/making parts for other little garage companies, or my own things) The amount of machine-shop I have crammed into a single garage got to be a bit of a joke. Also I need to expand into 3d printing before im left behind the curve, and a decent lasercutter too: both processes which Im currently reliant on a friend one town over. So double garage it had to be!

Anyway both my little boy and my friends little boy who lives a few miles away, love Thomas and anything steam train related. Although toddlers they grasp the difference between a 'push it around' toy and a 'just watch it go around the track' toy, so Im not too worried. Theres also baby number two coming to us so I should get a few years out of Thomas and sodor theme. Once they're older I'll look at more 'realistic, grown up' trains. I came into a job lot of Bachmanns G Thomas, Percy, Toby, James, and lots of stock. Plain DC, no DCC or mods. I plan to expand the rolling stock with repainted cheapo NQD tankers and anything 2nd hand I can grab. Gathered just enough used LGB track for two parralel loops and a pair of 5Amp start controllers.

Im slapping an office/materials store on the back of the new double garage so that will be the layout start point, and my wife has agreed to let it take up one edge or corner completely (closest to the back of the double garage) and also a loop completely around the edge borders - with the condition Im also building rockeries and borders while Im on, and it is ground level and not a trip hazard besides the house - not a problem.

I want to have it ready to run outdoors next spring, so boy number 1 and his friend can play with it to distract from the upheaval of a baby sibling - I'll be taking less or even no work on at that point as I did when the first arrived. With me literally working in my garage its actually pretty easy to get 'garden' stuff done, theres always an hour here or there to go dig or shift gravel for a little bit when Im waiting for something to cure, cut, melt or set, and if Im on my feet in the workshop Id rather do that than go do admin. (I set aside one day a week for the 'sit on my arse staring at a screen stuff' because I get migraines from it. One of the reasons Ive never looked back after leaving employment!)
Ive got autumn and winter to play with it indoors and understand the more complex electronics for what I ultimately want to do!

If anyone reading this wants to links me to topics, manufacturers or websites for the following queries please do when saying Hello!
  1. I was looking at the RRConcepts Stationmaster setup for alternating trains (Im planning one manually controlled track for shunting and play, and one automated to just let a pair run to watch - DCC seems too big a splashout while it remains primarily to enjoy with children) Ive been told that the 'one goes, one waits, then swap' setup is entirely possible to do with plug-and-play LGB components without buying the 'Stationmaster' modules from the US? This true? While there are piles of DC electronics for sale everywhere, theres zero information on what things are and how they all connect. Ive only just grasped how points work compared to self isolating HO ones, and that took a lot of Googling and decoding wiring plans. Stationmaster worth it, or can you tell me what I can buy that does the same from within Europe?

  2. Talking of printing and moulding - Troublesome truck faces for this scale anyone? Theres lots I can scratchbuild and convert for rolling stock, but if anyone has already made a variety of faces it saves me a lot of time!

  3. Inclines! I want at least one bridge or tunnel where the lines cross. I keep seeing '1 in 40' or 'no less than 1 in 30' bandied about but Ive seen videos that are clearly less than that, perhaps even 1 in 20! What have people reliably run on? Is it best to build inclines out of concrete beneath the ballast layer, so they dont sink over the years of weather?

  4. Has anyone (who isnt solely contactable by the digital binfire that is Twitter) made a Gordon model in this scale - its a future project I'd like to try. Remodelling a BR78 chassis isnt an issue (after all I have the entire workshop for cutting and milling small metal things), but if theres an existing 3D printable file out there for the bodywork it'd save me months of work!

  5. Buildings. Im fully skilled up and tooled up to make my own, mould them and cast multiples - but are there any producers out there making premade moulds? Silicone has become expensive the last few years.
    Premade kits, Im aware of a two producers of 'UK style' buildings: Canforth Models and Modeltown. Any others?

  6. Shows and exhibitions: boy number 1 loves going to watch the HO and O layouts at Newton Aycliffe Rotary Clubs shows - any large gauge shows in the North, or are we cursed to have to drive 2+ hours to the Yorkshire show in September, making a weekend of it with some National Trust properties?

  7. Cheap LGB track? On joining here and browsing I see Ive been paying a few quid over the forum rates for R2 curves and points so far :(
FWIW, once we're up and running in the new house, Im happy to be someone people can turn to for things they dont have the tools or materials to do themselves: White metal casting Im always happy to take on even the smallest things (can squash things onto unused space of other moulds). Other stuff (resin, metal machining, lasercutting) etc will be dependant on how I setup the workshop once moved and what Im focussing on at the time - wether thats a new baby or some made project like casting 100 rubber muskets or Gondorian belt buckles and scabbard fittings.

Thanks everyone!
3 keep you gradients as easy as you can, yes some do 1:20 and pay for it with small length trains or trashed gears. 1:40 is better if you can manage it.

Track Choppercook Choppercook had a load of LGB to move on the other day, his thread linked look at post #71.
 

Flying15

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Hello - totally new to G gauge, but had an HO layout as a kid. Experienced modeller, which I'll get to.
After living in a tiny new build far too small to raise boy number 1, not knowing where my medical wifes job would end up being, we're finally moving to a long, long saved for house with a decent sized garden and a bigger workshop for me.
For ten years Ive been modelmaking in some form as a dayjob: Props, replicas, rubber, foam, white metal casting - bit of everything. It was during the recession: after the sector I was working in post-graduation was cut to the bone, and a glut of quality machinery appeared 2nd hand due to companies going under, that it became my full time job. I realised I was making more money from 'selling hobby bits' than I was from my paycheque. I flip between projects as a contractor (TV, Theatre) and commissions (casting/making parts for other little garage companies, or my own things) The amount of machine-shop I have crammed into a single garage got to be a bit of a joke. Also I need to expand into 3d printing before im left behind the curve, and a decent lasercutter too: both processes which Im currently reliant on a friend one town over. So double garage it had to be!

Anyway both my little boy and my friends little boy who lives a few miles away, love Thomas and anything steam train related. Although toddlers they grasp the difference between a 'push it around' toy and a 'just watch it go around the track' toy, so Im not too worried. Theres also baby number two coming to us so I should get a few years out of Thomas and sodor theme. Once they're older I'll look at more 'realistic, grown up' trains. I came into a job lot of Bachmanns G Thomas, Percy, Toby, James, and lots of stock. Plain DC, no DCC or mods. I plan to expand the rolling stock with repainted cheapo NQD tankers and anything 2nd hand I can grab. Gathered just enough used LGB track for two parralel loops and a pair of 5Amp start controllers.

Im slapping an office/materials store on the back of the new double garage so that will be the layout start point, and my wife has agreed to let it take up one edge or corner completely (closest to the back of the double garage) and also a loop completely around the edge borders - with the condition Im also building rockeries and borders while Im on, and it is ground level and not a trip hazard besides the house - not a problem.

I want to have it ready to run outdoors next spring, so boy number 1 and his friend can play with it to distract from the upheaval of a baby sibling - I'll be taking less or even no work on at that point as I did when the first arrived. With me literally working in my garage its actually pretty easy to get 'garden' stuff done, theres always an hour here or there to go dig or shift gravel for a little bit when Im waiting for something to cure, cut, melt or set, and if Im on my feet in the workshop Id rather do that than go do admin. (I set aside one day a week for the 'sit on my arse staring at a screen stuff' because I get migraines from it. One of the reasons Ive never looked back after leaving employment!)
Ive got autumn and winter to play with it indoors and understand the more complex electronics for what I ultimately want to do!

If anyone reading this wants to links me to topics, manufacturers or websites for the following queries please do when saying Hello!
  1. I was looking at the RRConcepts Stationmaster setup for alternating trains (Im planning one manually controlled track for shunting and play, and one automated to just let a pair run to watch - DCC seems too big a splashout while it remains primarily to enjoy with children) Ive been told that the 'one goes, one waits, then swap' setup is entirely possible to do with plug-and-play LGB components without buying the 'Stationmaster' modules from the US? This true? While there are piles of DC electronics for sale everywhere, theres zero information on what things are and how they all connect. Ive only just grasped how points work compared to self isolating HO ones, and that took a lot of Googling and decoding wiring plans. Stationmaster worth it, or can you tell me what I can buy that does the same from within Europe?

  2. Talking of printing and moulding - Troublesome truck faces for this scale anyone? Theres lots I can scratchbuild and convert for rolling stock, but if anyone has already made a variety of faces it saves me a lot of time!

  3. Inclines! I want at least one bridge or tunnel where the lines cross. I keep seeing '1 in 40' or 'no less than 1 in 30' bandied about but Ive seen videos that are clearly less than that, perhaps even 1 in 20! What have people reliably run on? Is it best to build inclines out of concrete beneath the ballast layer, so they dont sink over the years of weather?

  4. Has anyone (who isnt solely contactable by the digital binfire that is Twitter) made a Gordon model in this scale - its a future project I'd like to try. Remodelling a BR78 chassis isnt an issue (after all I have the entire workshop for cutting and milling small metal things), but if theres an existing 3D printable file out there for the bodywork it'd save me months of work!

  5. Buildings. Im fully skilled up and tooled up to make my own, mould them and cast multiples - but are there any producers out there making premade moulds? Silicone has become expensive the last few years.
    Premade kits, Im aware of a two producers of 'UK style' buildings: Canforth Models and Modeltown. Any others?

  6. Shows and exhibitions: boy number 1 loves going to watch the HO and O layouts at Newton Aycliffe Rotary Clubs shows - any large gauge shows in the North, or are we cursed to have to drive 2+ hours to the Yorkshire show in September, making a weekend of it with some National Trust properties?

  7. Cheap LGB track? On joining here and browsing I see Ive been paying a few quid over the forum rates for R2 curves and points so far :(
FWIW, once we're up and running in the new house, Im happy to be someone people can turn to for things they dont have the tools or materials to do themselves: White metal casting Im always happy to take on even the smallest things (can squash things onto unused space of other moulds). Other stuff (resin, metal machining, lasercutting) etc will be dependant on how I setup the workshop once moved and what Im focussing on at the time - wether thats a new baby or some made project like casting 100 rubber muskets or Gondorian belt buckles and scabbard fittings.

Thanks everyone!
I’m Answer to the Gordon point whilst I E not built a replica Gordon I have built a couple of similar locos . Mine are based on the Romney Hythe locos.
I’ve also built a model of Edward. Some where within this site my descriptions of building these locos exist under my Flying15 name.4FEAC63F-8F14-452F-A68C-E6FF934DCDFF.jpeg04893B16-1DD5-428A-B576-661D2E1C11D0.jpeg4D93C1EA-1CE7-4F2F-A9AF-DB7043DC3427.jpeg259CD272-B4E1-408D-862F-785D39AD3E61.jpeg690434BD-6155-41B0-9BB4-C0AF2344C5AD.jpeg496BFE72-16EC-406D-AFA5-68C234FD6F10.jpeg
 
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viaEstrecha

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5. Buildings. Check out Brunel, which produces some utterly gorgeous things from laser cut foamboard, some available for self-assembly.

Brunel Models
 
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Gizzy

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Hullo and welcome to GSC!

You seem to be well ahead of the learning curve already. I guess most of your questions will be answered in due course.

I also started in G scale due to my then 8 year old son. He turns 35 later this month, so I've been doing G scale for a long time, but I haven't got a tenth of your modelling skills.

Ask away for any questions and I look forward to seeing your layout progress....
 

ThomasDadDurham

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Appreciate the warm welcome all!

5. Buildings. Check out Brunel, which produces some utterly gorgeous things from laser cut foamboard, some available for self-assembly.

Brunel Models
Wow, those are gorgeous - but many of them are where it'd make more sense to use my skills and materials to make my own - the quality is absolutely worth it, cant deny, but I reckon I'll either get second hand or lower quality ones I can spruce up and detail, or find time to make my own moulds. Wife loves me, but not 1.5k station loves me - especially when my day job is literally making models, haha.
I’m Answer to the Gordon point whilst I E not built a replica Gordon I have built a couple of similar locos . Mine are based on the Romney Hythe locos.
I’ve also built a model of Edward. Some where within this site my descriptions of building these locos exist under my Flying15 name.
Great models! I was surprised to realise there are real trains so close to Gordon - I'd always thought he was based off the Flying Scotsman - Im learning new things everyday off the Thomas wiki too, so I learned how to build his wheel layout from chopped up Marklin models before even what engines inspired him! Seems Henry is my sons favourite (perhaps because his favourite cat is also called Henry - all our pets have been named after TV shows from my childhood) so I may be making the big green fella in years to come rather than haughty ol' big blue!
Ive scoured 'threads created by' via your user profile but regret I cant find these builds: Im guessing stryene and lasercut parts? Or Brass? Do people use entirely brass at this scale if its electric, or is that the preserve of live steam crowd?
 

tac foley

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5. Buildings. Check out Brunel, which produces some utterly gorgeous things from laser cut foamboard, some available for self-assembly.

Brunel Models

Just be rich, is all I'm saying - almost £300 for a KIT for a 16mm signal box might seem a bit excessive for some.....
 

Flying15

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Appreciate the warm welcome all!


Wow, those are gorgeous - but many of them are where it'd make more sense to use my skills and materials to make my own - the quality is absolutely worth it, cant deny, but I reckon I'll either get second hand or lower quality ones I can spruce up and detail, or find time to make my own moulds. Wife loves me, but not 1.5k station loves me - especially when my day job is literally making models, haha.

Great models! I was surprised to realise there are real trains so close to Gordon - I'd always thought he was based off the Flying Scotsman - Im learning new things everyday off the Thomas wiki too, so I learned how to build his wheel layout from chopped up Marklin models before even what engines inspired him! Seems Henry is my sons favourite (perhaps because his favourite cat is also called Henry - all our pets have been named after TV shows from my childhood) so I may be making the big green fella in years to come rather than haughty ol' big blue!
Ive scoured 'threads created by' via your user profile but regret I cant find these builds: Im guessing stryene and lasercut parts? Or Brass? Do people use entirely brass at this scale if its electric, or is that the preserve of live steam crowd?
Hi the titles of the three threads referred to are:-
Edward-Thomas and Friends
Aristo Pacific motor block to Romney Hythe Pacific
RHDR 4-8-2 from Annie
I hope that helps
Chris
 

Paul M

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Welcome to the forum, one piece if advice you haven't asked for. Watch out for the humour, it's truly appalling at times :rofl:
The original Thomas books are based on real life and working rules of the railways at the time. The pictures, obviously faces and talking engines aside, are true depictions of railways, locomotives and rolling stock. This all changed after the Awdry family sold the rights
 
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JimmyB

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Hi, and welcome to the forum, you have had the obligatory warning about the humour, though not sure about photos, we love photos, so a photographic review of work carried out is always appreciated.
 

kedwards

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ThomasDadDurham

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I too run Bachmann Thomas large scale trains in my garden.
I've been blogging progress at The Wychbold and Stoke Prior Railway

Keith
Keith - that is remarkably like what Im planning and a similar size space! I have to ask, what is the gradient here, my maths may be off but I'd imagined Id need a nearly five metre run plus the diameter of the curve back to get a station and bridge high enough to run back over the track with a clearance of around 9-10 inches? At 'no less than 1-in-30'.
waspr.png
 

kedwards

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Keith - that is remarkably like what Im planning and a similar size space! I have to ask, what is the gradient here, my maths may be off but I'd imagined Id need a nearly five metre run plus the diameter of the curve back to get a station and bridge high enough to run back over the track with a clearance of around 9-10 inches? At 'no less than 1-in-30'.
The gradient is 1:40. The clearance under the bridge is just shy of 7.5 inches from the top of the rail to the Botton of the bridge. Tight curves add a lot of friction and severely reduce the length of trains that can be run.

This video shows a 20 truck train pulled by Diesel and banked by Paxton going up the gradient.

I will follow your progress with interest.

 
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Alpineandy

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Welcome to the forum. Large scale shows and exhibitions are a bit thin on the ground in the North. (I am just down the road from you)
I make a weekend of it to the Llangollen show which is excellent and there's lots of other stuff to see in the area as well. I presume the Yorkshire show you refer to is the one that was at Elsecar. This year it has moved to Barrow Hill Roundhouse near Mansfield so is even further away. However it's a fascinating place to visit so is worth considering.
 

Madman

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Welcome aboard.

I have a couple Thomas locos, Percy and Toby. They absolutely do not like grades. I cannot simply turn them on and watch them run due to the fact that they come to a halt on the grades.

RR Concepts has been around for quite some time. When I was running track power, I used some of their modules. That was thirty plus years ago. The owner, Curtis Roecks was extremely helpful and informative when I was getting started. Back the we communicated the old fashion way, paper mailings.....;)
 

TTaannggss

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Hello and welcome
 

korm kormsen

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Inclines! I want at least one bridge or tunnel where the lines cross. I keep seeing '1 in 40' or 'no less than 1 in 30' bandied about but Ive seen videos that are clearly less than that, perhaps even 1 in 20! What have people reliably run on? Is it best to build inclines out of concrete beneath the ballast layer, so they dont sink over the years of weather?

Cheap LGB track? On joining here and browsing I see Ive been paying a few quid over the forum rates for R2 curves and points so far

apart from a belated welcome... you being a self confessed largescale virgin, i'm astonished, that nobody mentioned the LGB manual.
here you find it: http://kormsen.info/lgb-manual.pdf
ther you find whatever you need for simple DC.
(the second part "Taking Control" will be the most interesting part)

inclines - although i, myself had very steep inclines in my last to layouts ( up to 1 in 17 and on one space even 1 in 13) i recommend to take it easy! stay below 1 in 50. going steeper you get into try and error area.
length of trains, weight of loco, curved or straight - a lot of individual factors. (best non-cog climbers i know, are older splitblock LGB Stainzes)

cheap LGB track - with your workshop buy one foot R1 curves. they are by far the cheapest. rebend them to straights or any other radius you need.
you'll find enough threads about bending rails in this forum.

reuse the original connectors. if need or caution tells you to, solder jumperwires for better connection.
since my last sentence will trigger some comments about railclamps being much better - they are better, in price too. where they absolutely make sense is for connecting turnouts.
 
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ThomasDadDurham

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apart from a belated welcome... you being a self confessed largescale virgin, i'm astonished, that nobody mentioned the LGB manual.
here you find it: http://kormsen.info/lgb-manual.pdf
[...]
Cheers matey - thats amazing - I actually recieved the paper copy of this - in fact three seperate books, two LGB ones and a generic 'garden railways' one covering construction and landscaping - with the job lot of trains which arrived this morning! Its really cleared up for me how the alternating passing loops setup works, without having to buy and import an RRConcepts Stationmaster, which was one of my initial questions! Theres four trains in this job lot, so an inside and outside track, with two alternating trains on each is ideal. Once my kid is older, and Ive a better idea what Im doing, a shunting yard will go on.
Finally ran a train and started working through the job lot I bought to test it all. Im going to post in the electrics re: my initial experiments - as at last until he's older its just going to be a (bypassable) timer switch controlled layout.
 

korm kormsen

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... Its really cleared up for me how the alternating passing loops setup works, ...
yeah, yeah. more than half a century ago my father used to tell me: "if you run out of ideas, how to make it work, try reading the manual..." ;)

korm
 

Paul M

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yeah, yeah. more than half a century ago my father used to tell me: "if you run out of ideas, how to make it work, try reading the manual..." ;)

korm
Steady on Korm, "Read the Manual " indeed!!!! This is a family forum!